Adeel 0:09
What's up, everyone? Thank you for tuning in to another episode of calm Talks. My name is a deal. And I'm here alongside Michaels. And we're here to help you lead a life of peace and progression, one calm talk at a time. Are you someone that wishes that you had a partner or team that you can work through different challenges have more success in your life? Well, then you're going to love this episode, because today, we're going to break down why a team is important, when to build a team and what to look for in order to build a top team. Now make sure you stay all the way to the end, so that you can learn the secret sauce as well.
Ant 0:42
But before we begin, I just want to take a moment to say thank you to everybody that's been sharing our support, tuning into our podcasts and sharing our content. We've been seeing ourselves grow consistently, and with followers with people sharing out on Instagram, and we really appreciate all the love and support we're getting, and actually keeps encouraging us to keep building good content. So thank you.
Adeel 1:03
Brilliant. Let's get started then. And as always, we're gonna ask you the first and most important question, why is the team important?
Ant 1:10
Yeah, great question. As always a great first question. When it comes to a team, right? For me, anyways, the most important thing when it comes to having a team, and why it's important is that you can counterbalance each other's weaknesses, you can increase each other's strengths, you basically amplify each other, where somebody may not be able to perform as well you bring them up, and they vice versa do that to you. So overall, you get a just a more balanced and higher performing, functioning set of people able to achieve a common goal. And I think that's actually really why it's important to have a team because you alone can do some great stuff. I'm sure you can we all can. We're all capable of something infinite, really within us, I believe so anyways, but we will have our blind spots. And a team, a good team and accountable team will help you, you know, elevate you to the next level and you elevate them together towards that common goal.
Adeel 2:01
I think at calm talks, we're always talking about leading a life of peace and progression. And it's all about balance. And we encourage that every step of the way. And that's what a team allows you to accomplish as well. It allows you to have balance in your life, because you're not going to be good at everything. And a lone wolf mentality only gets you so far. I'm saying that from experience. So having a team actually allows you to have more balance in your life, that you can focus on your strengths. Your team member has their own strengths. So I think a team is extremely important for those facets. Another factor for me for our team, on why that's important is that it also helps you be more accountable. I think when you take on any endeavor with a team, you sort of owe each other a bit more. And if you kind of keep each other accountable, you keep make you make sure that everyone's on the same track. If everyone if anyone derails takes a detour at any point, kind of keep them accountable and get them back on track.
Ant 2:54
Yeah, I think when you all have a shared goal, a shared vision, and someone's not pulling their weight, then it's really helpful for your team to pick you back up as they Hey, pull your socks up. We're supposed to be getting this down, we've got a clear vision or strategy we're trying to implement. You know, we need to do this together. We need you. We want you things like that. Right helps keeping you like you said accountable and on the on the path towards your goal.
Adeel 3:18
Now, have you worked with teams before? Do you have a lot of experience in this area?
Ant 3:22
You know, yeah, I think I am someone that has you fairly accomplished? By no truth. I don't think I've done anything alone. i The thing is right. As I you can say, oh, yeah, I know, I got this grade, for example, in school, or you know, I do this at university or wherever it is, or accomplish that work. You can always say I did, I did. And that's true, you probably did do a lot of stuff I did in my life. But I didn't do without anyone else. I really easy example to understand, I think a lot of people can relate to your school. And the day I took the exams, and you've taken exams, you pass them, we didn't do without your teacher helping you. Or you can do without your friends mocking in a minute or less, we'll go and study in the library together. That's still a team maybe didn't understand the time it was a team. But really, your teacher and your friends are part of your team. And that time when you went to pass some exams, fair enough, you did it or in my case, I did them exams, but didn't not do it alone. Assemble your family, my family would always encourage me to, you know, pursue my goals, my passions, whether that would have been studying or something personal. They're still part of my team. They were a different part of the team. They were the pilot team that was giving me that emotional support. Everyone is teaming all the time. You might not realize her in a team. So yeah, I think I've been in a team my whole life, different parts of my life of different people. But they're all effectively helped me. And I've helped them in return, achieve some sort of goal. And I'll show you the same.
Adeel 4:42
Yeah, I mean, before I even say that before I answer your question. There's a lot of humility in that as well, to acknowledge that even as being someone who is quite accomplished, taking a step back and crediting all the people who supported you in your journey. So I think there's a lot of humility in that. And yeah, I mean, I would agree, I think that Uh, for a large part, I have done a lot of things where I've taken a lot of responsibility, but I wouldn't be where I am today without the people sacrifice with other people's support. So family is obviously a big one that's like the team you're born into, you don't get to choose that team. And I've been blessed with that one with having the support and kind of getting a lot of chances in my life. And then of course, like at school, I would also say at work, I've been so blessed by having some phenomenal managers and mentors, who fight have guided me, but instill belief in me, like I've had moments where, when I was being promoted to a manager on my team, I wasn't really quite sure I was ready for it. And one of my mentors who used to be my manager, and had since been promoted, is actually the one who encouraged me gives me some words of wisdom and told me that if you're waiting to be ready, you'll never be ready. And that was exactly the push, I needed to actually go into that role. I've been blessed to have like good team members, and also more importantly, good leaders in my life. So totally, totally a lot of experience over there. So we talked about a couple of things. Let's jump into another really important question. When should a person be looking towards building a team? And is this a team only in the context of a professional setting? Or does it also apply in a personal setting?
Ant 6:17
Actually, two really great questions there. Firstly, in terms of when to build a team, I think it is important to distinguish sort of what your environment is basic timescales and question sort of encapsulating both, you know, in life essay, you struggled here for some relationship that you're in or some other personal relationship, you won't really go to your work team for that. Right. Obviously, we might, but certainly, I'd say you probably wouldn't do that right to keep them separate. Yeah, right. So you got to just you know, understand, obviously, where you're at, maybe your family or your friend network, that's that team to help we say personal interpersonal issues. And obviously, your work team, we help you with your work issues. And I think that's pretty self explanatory. But when to actually build that team, or in my opinion, I think is important to have a team constantly. But I'm also someone that's quite collaborative. Now, yes, I do things alone. But I generally, like to the earlier point I wrote I mentioned, I know, I'm nothing with other people around me. So for me, the answer when to build a team is actually constantly you should be constantly evaluating your team, you know me very well, I have a lot of friends. But they're all effectively part of a wider team, like a massive network of a team, and everybody in my life, contribute to something and they team with me on maybe it's financial things, maybe it's a podcast thing, maybe it's in a helping me my relationship, maybe it's at work. They're all part of the team of ant effectively, right? When do you have a team? You my opinion, I think that's most of the time. If you're not actively in some sort of Team network, team environment, you're gonna go down rabbit holes, and you may not achieve the things you want to achieve. I don't know if it's the same for you.
Adeel 7:50
Yeah, I mean, as I said, Man, when I was growing up, I definitely had a lot of moments where I would just go in there, trying to figure out everything by myself. Eventually, I realized I can carry that burden. So I mean, I've always had like a, I would say, like a close friend right beside me always had like some other teammates that I worked with. I just think it's so much more fun to accomplish and go through life when you have like teammates in your life. So I've always had like a small group of people who are very, very close to me. And I kind of share my my successes, my losses with them all the time. There's a great quote that I came across when I was a lot younger by Christopher McCandless, that happiness is only real when shared.
Ant 8:29
I love that quote, by the way, I actually love that quote, yeah, I've seen I love that movie into the wild.
Adeel 8:35
Yeah, brilliant movie. It's a book as well. But I've only seen the movie. And yeah, I love that quote, because that kind of puts things to perspective of, if you go through and accomplish different things, and there's nobody there to share it with you, you actually end up feeling quite lonely. We're actually going to be covering that on the next episode as well. So definitely tune in to like, just know about how you can navigate loneliness.
Ant 8:58
You know, a low on that point, right, I am going to ask you, so what kind of question we would cover it more in next episode. But you know, there is also something in there of when is it good to go alone? And when you ask them, when is it good to have a team? But there's also times in your life where it's good to go alone? Don't elaborate on that.
Adeel 9:16
Yeah, I think there's definitely some moments where it's probably better to go alone. If there's definitely a need for a a timely response where you need results faster, you probably do want to go alone. I think that working with a team, it requires collaboration. It requires alignment, a shared vision, a shared plan, there's a lot of room for things to fall through the cracks, I think when you want to go alone is when you have all the attributes and a skill set needed to accomplish that task on on your own. And more importantly, is that how time sensitive is that task?
Ant 9:51
Yeah, agree to in my head when I saw asked this question to you. I think about it instead of competence effectively what you just said, like if I know I'm the most competent person I know for this task, then it makes most sense for me to do that task. And that might just mean doing it alone. So if you are the most competent or you think are the most competent at a certain task, then that may be the time that you want to go alone, put your head down, bang it out, do it, and you probably the most efficient, because time obviously, is the most important asset you have. So you want to make sure you're doing things as efficiently as possible. And if that's you, in this case, maybe that's the time to go alone.
Adeel 10:26
That's such a great point. I mean, we've gone through moments where even when we're working on this podcast, that we're trying to outsource some of the work, right, and we're looking for people to add to our team. And as you know, we've had moments where we just had to kind of fix up a lot of the work. In that case, it didn't make sense that that person is the right fit for the team. Because even though we're delegating that work, and that we're trying to add them to the team, it's actually taking us more time to go and fix their work, and do the cleanups and the touch ups.
Ant 10:56
Have you got an example of when you teamed, but it was bad to be a lone wolf?
Adeel 11:01
That's a fantastic question. I'm trying to think about personally and professionally, I think personally, there's definitely been moments where I'm like, Okay, I'm probably better off doing it alone. But I'm trying to think about a professional setting, or where I teamed up with a person, and it really wasn't a good fit. I can't really think of many moments like that, I've kind of been fortunate also do think that I kind of do try to vet the person before I meet them, if I'm going to team up with them or not. I'm trying to think about moments where professionally, that wasn't the case, I would say that, you know, every time I've been in a situation where maybe I wasn't happy with the person's competence on my team, I would guide them and try to nudge them in the direction where their level would increase and improve. And in my experience, it has worked, thankfully. So I think I've been pretty fortunate where either I've had good team members and the times that I didn't, I was able to guide them. And they actually improved and raise their levels. The example that I'm thinking about, I mean, I'll share it is that there were moments when in my previous job, where we were doing a lot of traveling, I'm doing a lot of meetings in person, right, I'm a consultant, so just having to go to all sides traveling and meeting clients in person, a lot of meetings and workshops, etc. At one point, we're working for a pretty big networking client, I'm not going to take names, but pretty big corporation. And one of the person on the team who was the project manager wasn't really experienced in that position. Actually, she was a completely different position, she was a customer success manager. Actually, she was a content strategist who had been assigned to be a project manager, because we didn't have a true project manager, the account was so big, it was a massive account. And then she really wasn't doing quite well. And a lot of people on the team were actually quite upset with her, they were like, she's not good enough yada, yada, we need to like get a new person, my response was actually like, well, she's been put in a position where she's being asked to do a job, which is not her skill set. She's not competent in that. So instead of thinking like, Hey, we're going to find someone else, which is not going to happen, because the account is starting right now we don't have time to go hire a new project manager, that's simply not going to happen, we're going to find another person who's also not a project manager, assign them, that's not worth the risk. We put her in this position, we trusted her in the first place, we're not going to break that in a moment, you kind of have to go through and follow on give the person a chance. So met with her guided her a little bit more, maybe one of the leaders on the team. And she actually stepped up her level and raise their level and improved. And she became a really, really important asset to the team. So that's been my experience. And again, as I would say, I think I've been fortunate to have navigated those situations. I'll ask the same question back to you. Because it was a fantastic question.
Ant 13:48
You know, I probably give a good working example to you know, like a math major, or anyone that doesn't has no less than or right. Anyone who hasn't doesn't know, though, haven't maybe they're new listener. I'm a mathematician by trade. Alright. So I work with a lot of technical people. And sometimes they don't have the same ability to articulate complex tasks with complex issues are complex solutions. And neither do they have the ability to write them down in a way that is, you know, it's not as easy sometimes to write this stuff, right. And like, in a really simple way. All right. Oftentimes, again, you know, work with these really technical people, and I don't like the way stuff is written down. Like it just doesn't make sense. It's like somebody with less technical knowledge won't understand it, blah, blah, blah, right. So in that case, I oftentimes think, Oh, I could be a lone wolf here, because I can write this technical thing or complicated thing in a really simple way. But to your point, I don't always do that. In fact, I hardly ever do that. Because I think he's actually better to coach to lead to develop pupil. So yes, I do have many instances like that, but I just don't ever enact on them, because I don't think that's good development for everyone. end the day. We all want to feel part of it, I think anyways, mostly we want to feel part of a team feel valued, feel accepted, even in our weaknesses, right or, you know, weaknesses, quote unquote. So yeah, it's just you just teach you just coach and you, you raise their level. And equally I have my level raised because Amazon was good at a lot of things to be fair. No, who am I kidding? No, but in all seriousness, for me, I will say this a similar approach. But I think this actually comes on to the next point we really want you to raise was about how to build that team, because we've kind of covered both competence. And I character, that you covered it really well, in your situation whereby the person had a great character they able to develop, but didn't want to accomplish initially. So I think that's really part of the crux, when we talk about the how or how to build that secret sauce top team.
Adeel 15:50
Yeah, cuz you know, you're gonna have some people who have certain potential, and you're kind of looking for some markers and each individual to see who could fit into that puzzle. And complete that puzzle that you have. You can't throw a wrench in the machine and expect it to keep working right, you got to find the right oil, which is going to allow the machine to work effectively. So I've said this before, I know, I know, we were chatting about this off the mic. But the first thing is like character to me, like that is the number one thing I look for in a person when I'm trying to build a team. Because of course, there's competence that matters. I don't want someone who is completely incompetent. But I start with character, I started with values, I want to make sure that that person is someone that I can work for the long term, I want to share a quick story about something that I learned from Simon Sinek, who I'm pretty sure he served in the Navy. And he wrote the book Start With Why and leaders, the last will link them out in the show notes. And he actually speaks about the game six, which is in the Navy SEALs. And that's like six of the best of the best in the Navy SEALs who are part of that team. So it's really the toughest team to be a part of. And it's considered like one of the most successful and most efficient and effective organizations in the US. So he was a part of the Navy. And he asked them that, how do they recruit to the team because it's literally the best of the best. And they basically made a graph and they said they look at performance on one side. And they look at trust on the other side. And, of course, ideally, you have someone who has high performance, there's high interest as well. That's the ideal person, of course. But that's not always the case, you're never you're not always going to find that person. If they have situation where someone is high performance and low interest. They said that they would avoid that person like the plague. Because that is a toxic leader and a toxic teammate. You want to steer clear of that person, they would much rather have someone who is medium in performance and high interest. And sometimes they were even saying that they would rather have someone who's low in performance and high interest. But that's of course, a variable scale that depends contextually, in this situation. I think that kind of sums up my philosophy as to why I think this way is that I want someone who I can trust. The Navy SEAL actually talked about that. Like they ask the question, the question that the Navy Team Six is really asking with performance and trust is I can trust you with my life. But can I trust you with my money and my wife? So that kind of sums up the philosophy I have.
Ant 18:26
So you talk about character first for you is the character assessment, what are the kind of key things that you would look for when building a team or collaborating the team when it comes to character,
Adeel 18:34
I think it's someone with integrity. That's obviously the first place to start, or at least for me, anyway, someone who who displays integrity, someone who also displays empathy. I think also, it is really appreciated when a person does display humanity, there are certain markers that you want to look for, if a person is accepting of their own strengths and weaknesses, that's a better teammate, as opposed to a person who thinks that he can do no wrong he or she can do no wrong. So those are some of the things I look for. But I also understand that they're not always easy to identify. But I think with experience, you do try to pick up on these things much faster. And there are ways that you can kind of pick up on some of those cues. What about you, I'm going to ask you as well, what's something that you look for when you're building a team?
Ant 19:20
A character without doubt, right? You have to obviously get on with the person integrity, I think is a great word to use them. For me that actually means someone that does what they say and say what they do write, they kind of follow through with their words. And they do like with all their best intentions, that for me is integrity. It means that someone doesn't really speak on their values, obviously values between people are different. But especially we have similar values. And you are able to you know, enact on them and not be swayed. That for me also demonstrates integrity. So for sure, integrity. Empathy, I think is a massive one. You mentioned it regarding someone that can display like consciousness towards someone else's feelings. This is great, right? You obviously need that. And you also mentioned humility, some mean that he's able to self assess and understand their own weaknesses or development areas, these are great. I do think they're things that we definitely need. But I also think we need competence. Without competence, you're not going to get much done. And that's the truth. So when it comes to me assessing someone to be on my team, one of the first things I look for is, are they actually going to be good at the task, I'm setting them every perfect, they'd have to be at least a decent level. Now, there may be instances where they might not even be at a decent level, for example, podcasting is a good one, you and I never done this before. However, I didn't know that you was really a good speaker, you had strong values, you had a good understanding of yourself, and use them to help other people. There is a basis there for you to have competence in this, in my opinion, anyways. So not always do you have to have demonstrated competence, but you have to have demonstrated some ability within the area so that their competence can be implied. For example, a really sort of easy example is, let's say somebody needs to be a mathematician, like I said, before, less than somebody has to write some sort of mathematical paper, when I'm going to trust somebody who say a math major in the woods, somebody with the philosophy paper, the philosopher could do it. I'm not saying they couldn't do it. But maybe it'd be a bit more difficult for them to achieve the same level of output, the demonstration of the competence for the math major would be higher, even though both have never written that paper in a very sort of very simplistic example. So I do think competence, or assessing somebody's competence is also very, very key.
Adeel 21:34
I think competencies, like you said, it is crucial, because that's why things don't get done. Right, you could have someone who has impeccable character, but you also need to get results. So absolutely, I think it's paramount to for someone to have competence in a field, or at least potential, at least some markers where you can say that even if they're not competent today, that it can bridge that gap. Over time.
Ant 21:57
I agree, actually, I think potential is and really nice, summarized way of saying what I was saying they have competence, or at least potential to show that competence.
Adeel 22:05
And other thing that I kind of look at as well is like, which makes us successful and winning team, a top team is communication. I think if you're in a team, it's really, really important for people to be on the same page, and you're not always going to be on the same page. How you can bring each other closer to being on the same page is by communicating effectively. I always think about the analogy of like football teams like soccer teams, how many times have you seen a corner come in or like a cross come in, and then the keeper goes forward, and then the clatters with his own center back with his own defender. The reason that's happening is there was no shout for the ball. Right? If you communicate, you avoid those scenarios. And that's the team that we're talking about, just like defenders and the goalkeeper, but throughout the pitch, throughout the game, everyone on the pitch, the more they communicate, the more they can actually perform better as a team. And that I think is one of the key metrics for like a lot of successful teams, whether that's like, perhaps Barcelona pep city are set as Arsenal,
Ant 23:05
yeah, you got a drop
Adeel 23:10
from the league. But you know what? Communication, I think that that's something that I really think is extremely important for a successful team.
Ant 23:20
It completely agree communication is important. And I think communication does come down a lot to the character traits that we mentioned before, as well as obviously a host of other ones. But ultimately need to be able to be very candid with your team, be receptive to feedback, and be able to also give that feedback. So you can both constantly develop, and keep reinventing what you're doing to achieve a common goal, which I think is actually the third thing and that is really important. You both have to have a shared vision and a shared goal without having a vision, but having a strategy to accompany that vision, you're really not gonna get anywhere. So yes, you have to have a good character, yes, have competence, and you have to trust each other communicate well, but you also have to do it in line with the vision in a strategic way. Otherwise nothing will get done irrespective your character irrespective of your competence, irrespective of how good friends you are, without a vision, and a strategy alongside that vision. Nothing's really going to happen.
Adeel 24:20
If everyone just picks up an instrument and starts playing them is going to sound pretty shit. But in order to make a sound harmonious, everyone has a composition that they can follow. Everyone has a exactly the right notes to hit their instrument to play. And that's where the conductor's job is to orchestrate that vision so that they can all build and create a beautiful harmony. So totally agree with you. I think a shared vision is extremely important for a successful team.
Ant 24:49
So now we got people that have good good character. They're competent or at least have potential. You have people that are good communicators with one another and you have a shared vision. Most left.
Adeel 25:03
I think another thing that a team also needs from all its team members is commitment, commitment to the goal commitment to each other, to make sure that not only are you part of the team, but you also follow through on your commitments to make sure that if you ever said that, you're gonna get something done, you get it done. And you actually make the team a priority. That focus kind of goes away from who you are and what you are trying to do, right? Once you're part of a team, you are better suited to thinking about what's best for the team, you're constantly thinking about what's best for you. That ego is going to get into the way of this of the team being successful. What you're better off doing is actually committing yourself to the success of the group, so that you can work and win together.
Ant 25:48
Oh, yeah. And I said, so beautifully. Commitment is everything right? Soon as somebody in the team, either yourself or somebody else falls out of line, and they're no longer pulling their way. The morale goes down, heads drop. And you know, things start slipping and goals start becoming dreams, right? You don't want that. So you need to always have that level of commitment amongst each other, and obviously to yourself towards the goal, and towards each other. I think that said perfectly.
Adeel 26:16
Is there any other last tips that you want to leave the listeners with?
Ant 26:19
Yeah, and it's something that you mentioned that when you mentioned the orchestra conductor, and that's leadership. And I think leadership is often it's an assigned role. You know, there's a leader, for example, there's the conductor, or there's like, the counting on the football pitch, or the soccer pitch wherever it is, right. But you know, the way I think about it is that leadership is when everyone is a leader, because a leadership doesn't mean that you're leading or telling people what to do. It means you know, your strengths, you know, everybody else's weaknesses. And you're able to, you know, pinpoint that, and basically, maneuver the pieces on the on the board, so that everybody is in harmony with each other. That's a good leader, they lead by example, if you have, for example, a football pitch of 11 leaders, then they're all going to hold each other accountable, the organ have the strongest character towards each other, always tried to communicate, always tried to be accountable, always trying to go towards the vision, the goal. So leadership is not about assigning someone, it's about everyone being their own leader in the team. So yeah, you might have one person that eventually makes the final decision. But a team should be full of leaders, they should all be leaders, all looking to help each other out.
Adeel 27:36
Word leadership comes responsibility. And with responsibility comes pressure. So if any team member wants to be a leader, they just have to be comfortable that pressure. We talk a lot about that on Episode 10, where we talk about how to deal with pressure and how to become a better leader by recognizing the pressures of privilege. So definitely check that out if you're someone who's trying to become a better leader, because that is something that helps a team when it's full of leaders. Like you said, it doesn't have to be the title doesn't have to be the captain of the ship. It's just people who are taking their responsibility. And committing themselves to putting their best out each and every single time
Ant 28:16
I create a team full of leaders is one that doesn't necessarily need to be led, because they all hold themselves accountable.
Adeel 28:22
I just thought about like Inter Milan and Marina steam, because that's how I used to describe his theme in like 2008 or 2010 when they won the Champions League.
Ant 28:31
Really, I didn't even know that.
Adeel 28:32
Yeah, I think that's what he was saying. Like it was a team full of like warriors full of leaders.
Ant 28:37
I think of that Monday night team, you know, the one that came from the Academy with likes under surrender as a group of like, back home and Neville Brothers, you know, I just think they all seem to be leaders on the pitch, they all fought for each other. They all knew their role. They all knew they weren't their weaknesses, but they all dug in together, and they just want everything.
Adeel 28:56
That's a great one. I do feel like there was more leaders on the pitch back in the day when football was being played.
Ant 29:02
And that's a conversation for another day.
Adeel 29:04
We'll save that for another one.
Ant 29:06
Ultimately, it's about having a team full of leaders, and it starts with you, you have to be the leader yourself.
Adeel 29:12
So let's wrap up today's episode. Today, we talked about the secret sauce to building a top team. First, we describe why it's important for you to build a team. It's about having accountability with each other. And it's about allowing you to bridge any gaps that you have as an individual. But at the same time, you must also know when to build a team. When does it make sense for you to recruit other members so that you can accomplish a shared goal a shared vision, there certainly might be times where it makes more sense for you to go alone, because you are either more competent, or it just is a more time sensitive tasks where you would get it done faster. And most importantly, how would you actually build a team? What are the markers you're looking for? The person's character, the integrity, empathy and and values that they represent are number one, you also want to make sure that the person is competent, because they could have incredible character, but they're actually someone who is incompetent, then you're always going to be chasing cars. You also want to make sure that there is effective communication between a team because that's what makes a successful team. While you're working through all of these little nuances, make sure that there's a shared plan, a shared vision, a shared goal, where everyone is bought into that right aside, that is the commitment to that goal are all the team members, prioritizing not only the team's goal, but also the team itself. And lastly, look for team members who are leaders without the title of leadership. Because once you have a team of leaders, success will come by itself. And as always, stay calm.
Adeel 31:06
Thank you for listening to another episode of Calm Talks, and just as a reminder, if you liked what you heard, don't forget to subscribe and leave a review.
Ant 31:12
You can also find us at Instagram @calmtalks and join our mailing list by visiting our website at calmtalks.com.
Adeel 31:18
And as always, stay calm.