Adeel 0:05
Welcome to another episode of calm talks. We're here to help you lead your life of peace and progression one column at a time. My name is a deal, I went from someone who barely passed high school growing up in box, a country that's infamous for sectarian violence and political instability, to now being a successful consultant who manages some of the biggest accounts at a multibillion dollar tech startup in Manhattan.
Ant 0:26
And my name is and I have gone from growing up in one of London's most financially deprived and crime ridden areas to today working in New York City as management, and one of the world's largest consultancy practices, we have both turned our lives of chaos into calmness by focusing our minds on two main goals, achieving peace and progression. Today, we share our stories, our learnings, our mantras, and our guiding principles with you. So you too, can build your own life of calm.
Adeel 0:53
So let's jump into today's episode, Clash versus connection, the importance of overcoming cultural differences in your relationship. When it comes to dating, cross culturally, there's a lot of differences and challenges that may come up. Because you're just not familiar with each other's culture, a lot of times, especially if it's a foreign culture to you, where maybe you haven't visited the country, you're not familiar with their religion, their traditions. And that's where problems can arise. And you could have some conflict that come up. And that's where we're going to be talking about today and help you with some tips on how you can navigate those relationships. But before even going into that, let's define what culture is. Culture is when a group of people come together, will who share a set of values share a set of beliefs, sometimes that could be religion, as religious beliefs, I should say. And that's what represents a person's culture? And how would you define culture? Yeah,
Ant 1:48
I think you're really spot on there with regards to a culture is, I think culture, you don't use it, it is values for sure. It's definitely like a set of behaviors. It's something that we all kind of, when you share a culture, you kind of all understand the same thing behave the same way, many times. And you sort of do things in the same way, if you will. It's like an unwritten set of rules that you will understand. And oftentimes, I'd say culture is something that is not really questioned. For example, let's say you grew up from a certain part of the world, for a certain religion, there may be things that you just don't question, maybe come out in like your family values. For example, let's say your family always knows each other's business. And then we might be part of your culture, just for everyone to sort of be involved with each other. You don't think of that as being anything different, until you meet somebody where they're not really close to their family. And then you're like, oh, okay, there's something different there. So culture oftentimes is a set of behaviors that I would say that we, we display. And oftentimes I say, it's also something that we don't waise recognize that we're doing is so embedded within us, because you share it with other people that you know, you, like you share with people, they have a shared culture with. Something that came
Adeel 2:57
up actually recently, one of my colleagues, who is Pakistani as well, he still lives with his family. So you know, for a lot of other people at the office, I've seen them pass comments like, Oh, that's a bit unusual. That's peculiar. But to me, that's normal. That's something that I've grown up with a lot. That's very, very common in Pakistani and Muslim cultures, where the kids will stay with their family with their parents way past college and university. I remember when I was trying to move out after I was done with college, that was like, such a big deal for my mother, she she broke down in tears. And to her, it felt like I was about to die, or I'm going to the fucking war or something like that. And yeah, it's just a big cultural difference. And it's hard to explain to let's say, someone else who, from maybe another culture, outside of the Muslim religion, or outside of Muslim countries, because you leave your home at 18, which I'm assuming you did as well,
Ant 3:52
I actually have to home at 18 to go to uni. Okay, that was for a reason. But I'm also doing a separate background. So we also normally stay at home as well. So it's not actually just I would say, in this case, not just Muslim cultures or Muslim countries, typically, it could be just the doesn't really matter where you're from. So ultimately, it's about several behaviors that are, like, agreed upon from people that resonate with you, or in this case, are oftentimes described with through your family values. So all that to say, ultimately, what we're really trying to get here is that culture, if we were to define it, it's really just a set of common values and practices and behaviors that are shared amongst people with a similar culture to you. And oftentimes, they're probably not that question that much. You sort of take them at face value. And that's also why it can be hard to sometimes explain it to other people, and sometimes why it causes a clash, which is the topic of today's episode,
Adeel 4:49
Clash versus connection, and that's what we're going to focus on. You know, there's another example that I can actually share as well, which happened between us actually, not too long ago, when you and I were out on a double date, and that was Actually, that wasn't a double date, that was my birthday. And everyone was there, my girlfriend was there, all my closest friends, my sisters were there. And there was a point where you know, because you're European, you greet with two kisses on the cheek. And when you gave those two kisses to my girlfriend, I did not like that at all. Because in my culture and my religion, you don't even look towards it as a man or woman, you kind of like keep your distance, sometimes with some families, and some folks, they prefer that you don't even shake their hand, as you know, in some, like some people who might be extremely religious, I should say, I was gonna say extreme, but that's not even extreme is just like, extremely religious. But for my case, that was something that I didn't like it, it rubbed me the wrong way. And it's because I'm not used to it. It's not something that I'm familiar with. And I didn't like that. And that was a cultural difference between you. And I, for example, of course, what I did was, as you remember, I'm sure it just reached out to you. And I said, like, Hey, this is surely just a cultural difference. I know, you didn't mean any disrespect by it, but I would just prefer, she didn't do that. Because that's not really common in my culture.
Ant 6:07
That's such a great example. Because number one, of course, is a cultural difference for us, is actually opposite to your case, it can be disrespectful, right? When, ah, for me, where I come from, and their coach that we display, that's actually a sign of respect. And it's a sign that you, you treat them as your equal that you you value them is the same action, that means two completely different things. So you might be disrespectful, it's disrespectful, and to me is a sign of respect. And what I think is really good about this example is that it could have been a clash. But you just told me, Hey, you know, that's not how things go down for me. And for me, that is disrespectful. And equally, even though it's not my culture, I will turn around and said, Okay, I respect that. I don't think of it. I'm sorry, obviously, they're my bad. And no, for next time, no need for this to remain a clash, something that we just we keep moving. In other words, use it as a reason to form connection, even as friends.
Adeel 7:06
So important, I was really proud of I think how both of us handled it, because in that moment, I remember being consciously thinking about I'm not gonna say anything right now. Because that would in my head, at least make it a scene. Instead, I'm just going to reach out to you separately privately, one on one. And when I reached out to, I was pretty confident that you're going to be mature about it. And you were, you handled it perfectly as well, you explained your side that a sign of respect, but at the same time, I respect where you're coming from in your culture, and it won't happen again. There was no clash, actually, at all, because the focus was just on finding ways that okay, we're misaligned. How do we bring that alignment back? Even as friends?
Ant 7:43
Exactly. I think that really encapsulates the topic of this conversation is a clash versus connection. And why that can happen with cultural differences.
Adeel 7:55
Other examples that you can think of I know that Europeans do certain things differently.
Ant 7:59
Oh, yeah, Europeans do. Sometimes we do things differently. I guess it depends where you're from in Europe, especially comparing to Yeah, I mean, lots of parts of the world, I guess Europeans can be a bit odd. I know, like Europeans, like it's really common, for example, especially in some of the Scandinavian countries to like do dinners, you know, naked saunas, nudist beaches are a thing and in some parts of Europe, as well, which I think most people would be like, what? What's going on here? But yeah, you can sometimes have that in Europe. So it just depends, or I mean, we're going to define explicitly, but there are many reasons and people could be the one that's a bit odd. I can't imagine, in some Muslim countries, a nudist beach being okay. No, I mean.
Adeel 8:45
Yeah, that's, that's another good example, as well, because I think for both of us, the reason we're actually talking about this episode is because we are dating some women right now who are across different cultures. So your girlfriend is from a different ethnicity to yours. Same, same thing, in my case, as well. So nude beaches are an example. You know, greetings are another example. There could be such other subtle ones as well, just even the, the mannerisms of how you communicate. So that's where we're gonna actually get into next, which is how do you now overcome those cultural differences because they will arise, especially in the global world that we're living in now, where it's becoming more and more accessible, that you can move across borders, to different countries, and get situated with work, visas, and so on. So that's what we're gonna dive into next. And I think it's a pretty straightforward one, at least what we demonstrated as well as to just communicate openly. You know, don't let something fester don't actually shy away from what your culture is. And if you bottle it inside, it's actually going to burst out at some other instance because you're just trying to actually withhold something. So instead, recognize it don't react in the moment, find the right time and in a calm manner. Be empathetic towards the other person and then just communicate Oh, openly with honesty and transparency.
Ant 10:01
Yeah, completely agree with that. I mean, looking at our example is, is a good like basis for us to make this discussion. You didn't project anything to me. For you. That's disrespectful. And for me, obviously, it's the opposite, right? But you were very open to communicate didn't project I didn't say, oh, this person is disrespecting me, this person is trying to disrespect me, this person has the intent to be disrespectful, nothing projected like that. It was just open and saying, Hey, I didn't like this for x x reason and didn't make me feel good. Just letting you know. And you're aware enough to say, I'm pretty sure it's a cultural difference, just FYI sort of thing. And equally on my behalf, I could turn around and just be like, Oh, that's ridiculous to be dismissive. I could turn around and say, You're wrong, I don't agree with you. I could, you know, shun you away in some regard, or make you feel good or feel validated by instead, the open communication is received back. In this case, it was to empathize, to validate, to express understanding, and also express a difference of opinion, but ultimately, respect, I think that's the other thing that we're gonna get to, it's about respecting that difference. You have open communication to and from, be vulnerable, be open, be empathetic, understand other person's position, and do it respectfully.
Adeel 11:24
This is the cornerstone for establishing relationship establishing trust with each other. And, you know, we've got an example of like, how we, as friends kind of came across this in the context of a romantic relationship, and, you know, in, in terms of like, it was my girlfriend. But even with my girlfriend, who is American, she's born and raised over here, and we come across certain differences as well, some of those differences. For example, some of those differences that have come up are around just having like a male masu switch is not something that I'm comfortable with, you know, again, it's like culturally very, very different for me to like, have that be common. So that was an area where, you know, just spoke to her. And I said, you know, hey, that's not something that I'm comfortable with. It's not that I necessarily think that it's, I'm saying, your culture is wrong, that this is normal, etc. I understand this is normal in America. But for me, personally, I think that, you know, I would prefer if you get a female misuse, and then we just spoke about that had that conversation, and we were able to actually arrive at that, I will say that it's really important to just stay calm in those situations, so that you can actually explain to the person without taking offense to anything that's happening.
Ant 12:36
I think what's important in your example, is that you mentioned something else. With regards to how to solution this compromise. You understood each other's position, and you came to a compromise that you're both happy with. So we have here now empathy, open communication, respect, and of course, compromise. Is there anything else that you would say it could be a solution to when there's cultural differences?
Adeel 12:59
I think compromise is a huge one, because you have to meet each other halfway. There's certain things maybe are uncompromising, and you have to be open about that. Certainly, for me, I try to communicate what is something I'm not willing to compromise on. But generally speaking, you want to find actually ways to meet in the middle where you can. Apart from that, I think one thing that I've learned is that if a person can participate in your cultural differences, if the person can actually actively take a role in trying to understand the other perspective, the different experienced difference in culture, that's a really, really great way to actually build that connection, instead of building a clash. Something that I've experienced in that regard is a few years ago, when I was dating someone who was also American, born up in America, born and raised over here, she was actually coming to meet my family, and it was actually for eats, which is a massive holiday. It's a massive celebration for Muslims. And it's baked in a lot of tradition and culture where there's back home, there's like a public holiday. And there's a feast that always happens. You have family members that come over, you have friends that come over and you all celebrate together. In America, obviously, it's very different. Nonetheless, we're gonna go see my family. She had a Pakistani friend who she reached out to she got the traditional dress, which is a conditional bar, and she got that dress to wear just for ease. She also went and got Pakistani sweets just to go when she was gonna go see my family. It's a step like that where she was already participating by actually attending the event with my family. But she participated almost going a step step above and beyond by being part of this celebration, because I was going to wear that dress. She wore her dress, my friend, my sisters were wearing their dress. So she actually felt like a part of the family at that point when we took the picture together. So you know, fair play to her. She definitely got that one right. We're not together anymore. But yeah, she definitely got down in that
Ant 14:59
moment when You know, there was a difference that she looked to participate in, did that make you feel connected?
Adeel 15:07
Oh, so much. I mean, I appreciated so much that this person would go above and beyond to not only be there, but be a part of it was such a joyous feeling for not only me, but also my family. I know that at that moment, my family was really impressed by that. It meant the world for my mother to see, oh, there's someone who's coming into our home, who's not Pakistani, and she would completely be a part of our tradition and celebration.
Ant 15:37
The reason why I asked that is because that's really the goal here. Rather than the clash, to have the connection, I think we've actually given like a good five solutions, just to run over them again, empathy, clear communication, compromise, to be and, and to participate, that's four to four,
Adeel 15:56
I think that's for for everything else you can think of,
Ant 15:59
I think maybe just going off with participation is a curiosity, maybe as a subset, because really, when there are differences, rather than letting them pull you apart, maybe being curious and asking, actually allows you to participate. So maybe part of participation is also being curious.
Adeel 16:18
That's a great one. Because I can certainly be a bit judgmental at times, I recognize that about myself. And I actively do try to be more curious about other people about where their culture and traditions come from. So I think that's actually a great piece of advice. And something I'm generally trying to incorporate in all of my relationships, not just romantic.
Ant 16:37
I think we should take a quick intermission here, actually, we've spoken quite a lot about culture, what culture means, how it can crop up in your relationship, and also some solutions. So let's take a second and ask you as the audience, what are some of the ways you have overcome cultural differences? Do you have a story, how that happened, or how they went about? We'd love to hear it. So if you do, please reach out to us, you can DM us on Instagram account tubes, you can also gas on our website, we'd love to hear from you.
Adeel 17:11
Yeah, and if you're listening to this on Spotify, we have actually started posting the question on Spotify lately. So if you're in there, just pop in and give us your thoughts over there, too. And lastly, we're just gonna emphasize why this is important. What's the benefit for you to actually be curious, be participating, or rather not be participating or participating in the other person's culture? Why should you be empathetic and compromising these situations, the benefit of that is that it builds a bridge between you to two different cultures coming together is going to require some level of understanding amongst each other. And when you focus on that curiosity on that connection with each other, you actually build a deeper bond with one another, it actually makes you feel so much more open and vulnerable with that person, every time I go out. And if I see a person who speaks another language, and if I can say even a word, just even hello in their language, they immediately is actually open up, they had the biggest smile on their face. And you can learn more than Hello, that's better. Like I used to do this thing a few years ago, where I used to go and ask people that if they spoken to the language to teach me how to say what's up. So you know, the one that's off the top of my head, like in Polish, it will be sold on swatch. The next time I met someone who's polish, they're like, oh, yeah, that's, that's actually nice that, you know, you can say something like that you just share enough? Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. But it's just important to open another person up. There's so many benefits to it.
Ant 18:50
I think ultimately, what you care about here is forming connection, rather than having some way to be disconnected, we really care about is how can I use different to build that bridge between us, like you said, so I think the biggest benefit is really just to strengthen your relationship.
Adeel 19:06
So I mean, yeah, the other places that this will come up is, you know, something I mentioned earlier, in terms of like the family, you know, with your family, having someone brought back to your home, we all have, you know, we've all had that experience, especially in some cultures, which might be more strict about their tradition, if you bring someone outside of your culture that they might be a bit hesitant towards that. And the way to overcome those differences. The way to overcome that hesitation, those doubts is by showing that you're willing to participate in their culture be a part of the family. So I think even from that perspective, you're trying to build a long term relationship. It just comes in so clutch when that person is actually showing that effort. The last thing I want to mention as well about overcoming cultural differences is just the consistency that you have, not only for yourself, but For the kids. Now, I'm assuming that you know, if you're planning to have kids or you already have kids, for the kids perspective, they're going to be getting a bit of both cultures. So for them to get the experience and get a little bit of consistency, and also see your relationship of how you don't belittle each other's culture, but you're actually focused on understanding each other's culture, it's going to be actually a great way for your kids to learn that curiosity from you.
Ant 20:27
And also respect my ultimately, we should all end to be respectful everyone, regardless of our differences, any differences, including cultural, and if you bring kids into the equation, and to be fair, if you don't, having that respect for someone else's culture, traditions, values, is a surefire way to build a stronger bond. Yes, the kids may benefit if you have them. But even if you don't, it's still going to strengthen your relationship. Respect, I think is at the core,
Adeel 20:55
you know, and on that note, I think we'll just wrap up. If you're anyone who is in a relationship, which is across two different cultures, or maybe even more, it's best for you to actually focus on the connection, try to recognize when a clash is brewing, be proactive with it, and try to empathize and communicate very openly, with a level of curiosity with the other person. And that's the best advice that we can give you. And as always, stay calm.
Thank you for listening to another episode of calm talks. And just as a reminder, if you like what you heard, don't forget to subscribe and leave a review.
Ant 21:42
You can also find us on Instagram at calm talks and join our mailing list by visiting our website at calmtalks.com
Adeel 21:48
And as always, stay calm.